From: santoken@bright.net
Date: Thu Sep 22 2005 - 08:37:25 PDT
Yes, Rick, he does work for free then. Perhaps you should do a bit more research independantly on 'Flat Rate' to get a real good understanding...it makes total sense.
>
> From: Rick v100 <rickv100@yahoo.com>
> Date: Thu Sep 22, 9:45 AM
> To: santoken@bright.net, Military Vehicles Mailing List <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
> Subject: Re: Re: [MV] Free estimates
>
> so if I come to your house to fix your PC and it takes
> 5 mintues and I give you a bill for an hours work
> that's fair?
>
> Why is it that only working on machinery uses this
> rate structure?
>
> The rate structure encourages speed rather then doing
> a job correctly. How are returns handled? If I want to
> make 80 hours I push through as much work as possible.
> Does he work for free if a car comes back unfixed?
>
> Rick
>
>
>
>
> --- santoken@bright.net wrote:
>
> > How could it be anything but fair?
> >
> > Look, you know when you take your vehicle in for
> > repair, it's gonna cost this much 'time', the dealer
> > knows exactly how much you're gonna pay as well as
> > how much it's gonna cost him. The guy doing the
> > work knows exactly how much he's gonna make doing
> > the job. It's the closest thing to menu pricing you
> > can get. You will pay the same price for water pump
> > replacement as the guy before you and the guy after
> > you (providing the FR time is the same such as the
> > same vehicle, etc.).
> >
> > The only varible in the situation is the tech that's
> > doing the work, and he's the one that makes the
> > money if he gets it done sooner, not the shop. If
> > the job pays 1.2 and he does it in .8, he gets paid
> > for 1.2, you get charged for 1.2. the dealer made
> > no extra money there. Where the dealer benefits is
> > the productivity...the speed the cars come in and
> > out...not on a per job basis, it's a per day basis.
> >
> > Look at it this way, it a guy works for 40 hours a
> > week, and he's good, he can make upwards of 80 hours
> > a week. My opinion is that if he works his ass off
> > to make 80 hours (tool investments, training, it all
> > enters into it), then he deserves to make 80 hours.
> > He's the only varible. Yeah, the shop made 80 hours
> > too, but not by overcharging anyone anything...it's
> > all flat rate.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > From: Rick v100 <rickv100@yahoo.com>
> > > Date: Thu Sep 22, 9:18 AM
> > > To: santoken@bright.net, Military Vehicles
> > Mailing List <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
> > > Subject: Re: Re: [MV] Free estimates
> > >
> > > Not to start a flame war but how is flat rate
> > fair?
> > >
> > > Of the few mechanics I have spoekn with they are
> > under
> > > pressure from management to come in under the flat
> > > rate those that don't are fired. This pumps the
> > shops
> > > profit as they are billing for more hours then
> > they
> > > are actually working.
> > >
> > > Rick
> > >
> > >
> > > --- santoken@bright.net wrote:
> > >
> > > > Flat rate..it's how every shop that's worth
> > having
> > > > work done at does it. If a job pays/costs 4
> > hours
> > > > and the shops rate is $50, the job is gonna cost
> > > > $200 in labor...no matter if one guy takes 20
> > > > minutes to do the job or 10 hours. It's a fair
> > way
> > > > of doing/quoting work.
> > > >
> > > > Kent
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > From: Rick v100 <rickv100@yahoo.com>
> > > > > Date: Thu Sep 22, 8:49 AM
> > > > > To: "Military Vehicles Mailing List"
> > > > <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
> > > > > Subject: Re: [MV] Free estimates
> > > > >
> > > > > They should have clearly stated on the service
> > > > sheet
> > > > > how they calculate service time and base rate.
> > > > >
> > > > > Most shops use the book rate not man hours
> > unless
> > > > > specifed on the sheet.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rick
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- Sonny Heath <sonny@defuniak.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > There is no law against them putting more
> > than
> > > > one
> > > > > > mechanic on the job,
> > > > > > thats probably what they will say when you
> > tell
> > > > them
> > > > > > about the time. They
> > > > > > were talking "man hours" I'm sure.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Sonny
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Ron" <rojoha@adelphia.net>
> > > > > > To: "Military Vehicles Mailing List"
> > > > > > <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
> > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 10:48 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [MV] Free estimates
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > OK.... Their labor rate is $75/hour. They
> > > > opened
> > > > > > at 0700, call me at 0740
> > > > > > > with an estimate of $2100, I say no to the
> > > > > > repairs, get charged $145.90.
> > > > > > > It took them 30 minutes, plus or minus to
> > > > bring
> > > > > > the vehicle into the bay,
> > > > > > > pull the wheels, inspect the shoes and
> > pucks,
> > > > look
> > > > > > at the exhaust system,
> > > > > > > look at the rusted brake lines and
> > generate an
> > > > > > estimate and call me. The
> > > > > > > photocopied charge sheet they wrote the
> > > > 'numbers'
> > > > > > on had 2 time punches on
> > > > > > > it, 0711 and 0757. The itemized bill I
> > > > received
> > > > > > had two 0.5 hour charges
> > > > > > > (brake line inspection and exhaust
> > inspection)
> > > > and
> > > > > > one 1.0 hour charge
> > > > > > > (brake inspection). Told me if I give the
> > OK,
> > > > I
> > > > > > could get the truck
> > > > > > > 'around 3' (PM). The 'estimate' was for
> > 11.5
> > > > hours
> > > > > > of labor + the 2 hours
> > > > > > > charged to the 'inspection'. 0700 to 1500
> > > > looks
> > > > > > like 8 hours to me
> > > > > > > without stopping for lunch or counting the
> > two
> > > > > > roach coach stops. They
> > > > > > > were going to charge me 13.5 hours 'book'
> > > > labor
> > > > > > for 7.x hours of actual
> > > > > > > labor. Sweeeetttt.....
> > > > > > > This after I was told when I made the
> > > > > > appointment that it would be
> > > > > > > around $800 to $1K. But the service
> > advisor
> > > > who
> > > > > > quoted me on Thursday
> > > > > > > couldn't be found yesterday when I dropped
> > it
> > > > off
> > > > > > at 1700 or when I got
> > > > > > > there today.
> > > > > > > I expect a business I deal with to make
> > a
> > > > > > profit. I don't expect them
> > > > > > > to make the quarters profit off me, all by
> > > > myself.
> > > > > > > As we left, my wife remarked she
> > thought
> > > > that
> > > > > > the Service Department of
> > > > > > > a Volvo dealer we had bought a couple of
> > cars
> > > > from
> > > > > > before was crooked, but
> > > > > > > he was a pansies compared to the shake
> > down
> > > > > > artists we just paid to bail
> > > > > > > out the truck.
> > > > > > > They must be doing something right, it
> > just
> > > > > > won't involve me.
> > > > > > > If this is the way you charge your
> > > > customers,
> > > > > > good luck. May the rubes
> > > > > > > continue to fall through your door.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Off to Gilbert, will probably be off
> > line
> > > > until
> > > > > > Sunday. You guys play
> > > > > > > nice in the mean time.
> > > > > > > And a sincere wish for good luck to
> > you
> > > > folks
> > > > > > on the Texas Gulf Coast.
> > > > > > > Rita sounds like she's gonna be a real
> > female
> > > > dog.
> > > > > > > Regards, Ronzo
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: <MYDEUCEANDWILLYS@aol.com>
> > > > > > > To: "Military Vehicles Mailing List"
> > > > > > <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
> > > > > > > Sent: 21 September, 2005 22:39
> > > > > > > Subject: [MV] Free estimates
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >> If you ask for an estimate that is that
> > > > > > extensive, they are definitely
> > > > > > >> entitled to be paid for there time, Being
> > > > self
> > > > > > employed since 1976 I
> > > > > > >> find it hard
> > > > > > >> to believe what people ask for and expect
> > it
> > > > to
> > > > > > be free.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
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> > > > > > > To reach a human, contact
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> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.4 : Fri Oct 28 2005 - 23:27:11 PDT