----- Original Message -----
From: Geoff Winnington-Ball <gwball@sympatico.ca>
To: Military Vehicles Mailing List <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 4:01 PM
Subject: Re: [MV] "Memphis Belle" and More
> .... What about the way a couple of enterprising gentlemen who
> recovered WW2 navy aircraft from the depths have had them confiscated by
the
> U.S. Navy, who couldn't care less about the private money spent, or the
lost
> dedication and resulting bad publicity these actions generated?
***** USN's point is that the USN STILL owns the airplane.
***** Many years ago to an MV collector in Canada who obtained a 'derelict'
half-track and rebuilt it. Guess what. COme registration time the owner
objected to someone having taken their vehicle and laid claim to it. If
someone took a CMP that you were storing on a friend's farm and rebuilt it
without your knowledge, I am sure you would be upset. The money spent is
irrelevant if it is not yours.
**** A similar argument for the PT 309 (?) boat down in Texas. The
volunteers do not gain ownership simply by spending money and time on it. I
am curator of a city museum and we have had volunteers rebuild a million
dollar carousel for us, a 1924 Model T Ford, two CPR section handcars (one
of which we gave away today to another museum in Rossland, BC who's
volunteers had restored it) and are offering to restore a 1912 St. Louis Car
Company Interurban Tram (that was used locally from 1913 to c. 1958) for our
museum.
>
> ... speaking of bureaucracy, in Canada,
> there are NO controls over private ownership of tank cannon or the like, I
> suppose because it's acknowledged that no ammunition can by nature and
time
> exist in private hands.
***** Basically correct I believe as explosive ammo is covered under the
explosives laws here in Canada. If cannon is full automatic then one might
well have a different problem.
> So far so good. HOWEVER, if you wish to bring one into
> the country, ANOTHER bureaucracy will demand formal deactivation by
cutting and
> welding, even though the item in question is legal WITHIN the country.
****** Which department and under what justification? Let's check this out
and see about getting the situation changed.
> So, take this as an example. Even though Canada manufactured 1,948 Ram and
1,420
> Valentine tanks in WW2, not one running example exists in this country
(for that
> matter, I know of no running Rams ...
***** Jim Whitham at the Canadian War Museum would like to get a Ram
running. To aid ther process I passed on a lead to him on a RUMOURED burried
Ram in Canada.
***** The Canadian War Museum has a complete Canadian built Valentine tank.
50 were built for the Canadian Army on CDLV 67 (the one at CFB Borden is
probably one of those) and 1,390 on Supply Mechanization SM 1021. Those
ended up in the USSR (after they switched sides in June 1942). This
particular tank was lost in battle by the Soviets when it sank in a bog.
Local villagers salvaged it a few years ago and it eventually made its way
back to Canada. There is a Soviet T-34 there in the CWM collection as well -
for comparison.
**** Jim Whitham would also like to get a Canadian built Skink tank restored
and running (the Skink was an M4A1 Grizzly with four 20mm guns in a special
turret). Only 3 such tanks were made and 8 turrets (for kits) on Contract
CDLV 3565. I saw one Skink turret in 1985 in the Bill Gregg Canadian
Collection and it should still be at CFB Shilo, Manitoba. I told Jim about a
second surviving Skink turret that I found (fllowing a fellow collector's
lead) a year ago.
***** The GOOD NEWS is that so many of the running Shermans in collectors'
hands today are CANADIAN built M4A1 Tank Grizzly I (an incredible survival
rate out of the 188 built on contarct L.V. 558).
***** Of course, even when we get tanks running in Canada they do not always
stay that way. Bill Gregg had his Stuart, Sexton, and Grizzly running when I
did the appraisal on his collection in 1985. Stuart has been traded off the
the Lord Strathcona Horse who "just got it running". Grizzly I was told was
left parked between buildings at CFB Shilo and open to the elements and
weather. Last rumoured to be shoved in the back of a warehouse there.
Artillery does not get too excited about armour.
> Regards,
>
> Geoff Winnington-Ball
> MAPLE LEAF UP! ==>
> Zephyr, Ontario, Canada
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Maple Leaf Up - The Canadian Army Overseas in WW2
> http://www.mapleleafup.org
> <sunray@mapleleafup.org>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 1st Canadian Armoured Carrier Regiment
> http://www.1cacr.org
> <info@1cacr.org>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>
>
> Robert Barber wrote:
>
> > About as sad as the story for the Shoo-Shoo Baby now out at the
> > Air Force Museum .. In short she was a real combat vet.. One of
> > the TIGR people from Smithsonian found her hulk in an airfield
> > in Denmark (i believe)How it got there and the story of the orignal
> > pilot is another set of tails themselves. Contacted the original
> > pilot and he went to great lengths to get the plane brought back to
> > the US.
> >
> > The plane was totally restored by volunteers back to flyable
> > condition at an east coast Air Force base. Part of the deal
> > was that the still living original crew was to get a flight in
> > the plane as reward for helping getting it restored.. And don't
> > you know the Air Farce reneges on the promise and has the plane
> > flown to Ohio with minimum crew..
> >
> > The good news is they have an actual combat vet B-17 on display.
> > The bad news was the CS way they delt with the people who put
> > the time and energy into making it happen..
> >
> > Bottom line is too much politics involved where it belongs least.
>
>
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Sun Dec 03 2000 - 20:29:47 PST