From: everette (194cbteng@bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu Aug 12 2004 - 11:41:28 PDT
I agree that hooking to frame would best, and really you would need to go
from frame to bed with mount or cut hole in bed so you can hook to frame...
My jeep has permanent droop to springs from tying down to frame rather than
axles. However if you look at the way vehicles are secured by professional
car movers they are tied to frame - but they do not care if it causes
springs to droop.
All this said and all precautions taken of collision is severe enough all
the chains and tie downs you can put will not be enough
Everette
"----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Ternes" <racecadet@yahoo.com>
To: "Military Vehicles Mailing List" <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
Sent: Thursday, August 12, 2004 12:17 PM
Subject: Re: [MV] Hauling IN an M35
So... I'm building up my M35A2 specifically to
use as a car hauler. I'm actually trying to do my
damnedest to replicate Tom "Fastest's" M35a8 on
the cheap, but that's another topic entirely.
Yeah, yeah, I should have gone civvy as soon as I
realized that the stock mill was too weak, but
now I'm in love with the truck and can't give it
up. Serious. ;)
If you are looking to tie down straight to the
bed, first off, look at what the bed is made out
of - For the most part, off the top of my head,
it's about 10 gauge steel in the floor of the
bed. It's one thing to stitch on a scab plate to
engage more of this relatively thin material
(like the mentioned farmer's "keyhole plate"),
but if you're really going to haul, you need to
tie into more substantial bed members (better
yet, go all the way to the frame). I honestly
can't think of anything on the stock bed that I'd
be 100% confident securing a heavy vehicle to for
a long haul at "freeway" speeds.
For instance, in terms of potential damage, the
best case damage scenario on using a keyhole
plate like that mentioned is that it will lightly
tweak the floor of the bed (which is presumably
designed for downward and not upward or sideways
forces), but worse case is that the bed itself
will fail around the welds on the edge of the
keyhole plate (probably just past the weld in the
HAZ), and can-opener the metal to complete
failure. That would be alot of force, but in an
accident, depending on speed of decelleration,
forces can become extreme.
So my take on this is that it's prudent, wherever
possible, to tie direcly into the "stronger" bed
members, but even better to go straight to the
frame. For the rear, I'd have redundant straps
from the Pintle hitch, and I bet that the
bumperettes on either side of the pintle would
also prove worthy. The front is a wee bit more
problematic to get a good downward pull (to
preload the suspension) but probably still
possible if you're creative.
Another comment on hauling or towing a vehicle is
that it's more prudent to tie down the frame than
it is the axles or tires. Although one of the
previous poster is on the right track with
securing the wheels so they won't move, the best
policy is to secure the frame, while compressing
the suspension slightly (preloading), since this
more accurately controls the inertia of the
vehicle itself. It's one thing to deal with the
weight of the vehicle through the "unsprung"
components (axles,wheels,tires etc), but by
directly dealing with the weight itself through
frame tie downs, you're a step ahead of securing
the axles themselves. I've seen both leafs on an
axle snap before, and it's both axles detaching
is very conceivable in a hard accident. Use the
frame - for instance, there are these little oval
holes in the each corner of the frames of
vehicles sold in the US, which are intended for
use as tiedowns.
The upshot through all of this is that the stock
smoothsided bed (the dropside would be better)
offers little in the way of positive security for
a vehicle vis a vis a flatbed designed for
hauling.
Well, just so you know where this is coming from,
I'm a technical rock climber and also an
obsessive offroading enthusiast, so I've trained
my brain to think about the worst possible
scenario and I always go overkill. ;) I plan on
putting a few days of work into the bed for its
transformation into car hauling duty.
Cheers
Bob Ternes
1968 M35A2
--- Jim Stead <gadget@easypath.com> wrote:
> I've only hauled a Willy's MB in mine. I'm sure
> I've gone overkill with this
> setup but no matter how I've driven my Deuce,
> the vehicle in back hasn't
> moved anywhere.
>
> Most important part...the rear supports. I
> figure in a panic stop, slamming
> into a Pinto, etc., this is what keeps the jeep
> from hitting me in the back
> of the head. It's not foolproof, but a pair of
> 20,000Lb transport chains
> wrapped around the rear cross-frame of the
> deuce (where the pintle is
> mounted), up over the tailgate, to around each
> of the rear frame rails of
> the jeep seems pretty solid to me.
>
> The front is tied with nylon tow straps from
> the front axle of the jeep near
> the tires, over the front wall of the cargo
> box, down to each Deuce frame
> rail. I use ratchet straps here and pull in all
> the slack I can at this
> point. Once the straps are as tight as I can
> get them, with the jeep still
> in neutral, I go back and pull the chains
> together behind the tailgate with
> 3/4" hemp rope. This pulls in ALL the remaining
> 'slack', both front and
> back. It's REALLY tight. Then I put the jeep
> into gear.
>
> The sides of the jeep frame are then tied with
> 3/4" hemp rope which runs
> over each deuce side, through the tiedown loop
> on that side, and onto the
> tie down pin mounted between the axles on top
> of the leaf springs. I pull
> the ropes as tight as possible by hand, while
> standing next to the
> truck...usually with my feet on the rear tires.
> This pull is nothing
> compared to the front-back pull, but it's
> enough to keep away any sideways
> movement in normal travel.
>
> Finally, I chock the wheels of the transported
> vehicle. I made "chocks" out
> of 2x4's laying flat on thier wide side. The
> bottom is a 3-piece U-shaped
> part which just fits around the tire. The upper
> part is a somewhat smaller,
> tighter U which is tight to the tire at the
> higher level. Both levels of
> 2x4's are well nailed together, think of them
> as 'reverse steps'. On the
> inside of the tires I have bungee cords going
> from a nail on each end of the
> U, just to keep them on the tire. This is silly
> really, those chocks aren't
> going anywhere, but just to make sure they
> don't walk off....
> The tires of the transported vehicle cannot
> move forwards or back, and don't
> seem to move sideways either.
>
> To me, tight straps reduce the possibility of
> inertia generation. In other
> words, when you hit something or your movement
> changes rapidly, the
> looseness in the straps, chains, etc allows the
> generation of stored energy.
> By keeping the load physically connected to
> your transport, you have no new
> energies to be concerned with. The bed isn't
> going to fly off, and neither
> is your load.
>
> Your tractor is higher than a jeep, so there's
> a new consideration....twist.
> Center of gravity type stuff. If it were me, I
> would add 'over-straps'. That
> is, something either connected to the top of
> the tractor (best case
> scenario) and tied down tight to the frame of
> the deuce, or something at
> least over the load (hood, ROPS, etc) and
> pulled as tight as possible back
> down to the frame of your deuce.
>
> Well, that's my 'overkill' approach to your
> question. I bet you could run
> off-road with this solution. I haven't tried
> it, YET. Still, get as close to
> this as you can for the road and I bet you'll
> have no worries......
>
> :-)
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
> > How does everyone chain things down that they
> might haul in the back of an
> > M35? I have to transport a Farmall H to a
> tractor show tomorrow, and I am
> > wondering what common practice is for
> chaining things down in the back. I
> > know some of you transport your M151's and
> such in the back of a deuce so
> I
> > am looking for experience type suggestions.
> Yes RAM, I did look in the
> TM's
> > for this!!
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> >
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