From: Nigel Hay (Nigel@milweb.net)
Date: Sun Aug 29 2004 - 15:51:45 PDT
Spare us this stuff for gods sake, its mind numbing in its dullness.
Along with many of the esteemed readers of this bugle I don't give a toss
whether or not Kerry fought for the Germans in the far east or is a former
porn star. If it aunt about military vehicles its in the wrong
trench.......... please desist before we unleash Boris Johnson on you all.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Royce C Hayes" <rc_hayes1@juno.com>
To: "Military Vehicles Mailing List" <mil-veh@mil-veh.org>
Sent: Monday, August 30, 2004 12:28 AM
Subject: [MV] Fw: OT Political: Bring it on, John!!!
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
>
> Bring it on, John
>
> Oliver North (archive)
>
> August 27, 2004
>
> "Of course, the president keeps telling people he would never question my
> service to our country. Instead, he watches as a Republican-funded attack
> group does just that. Well, if he wants to have a debate about our
> service in Vietnam, here is my answer: 'Bring it on.'" -- Sen. John Kerry
>
> Dear John Kerry,
>
> As usual, you have it wrong. You don't have a beef with President George
> Bush about your war record. He's been exceedingly generous about your
> military service. Your complaint is with the 2.5 million of us who served
> honorably in a war that ended 29 years ago and which you, not the
> president, made the centerpiece of this campaign.
>
> I talk to a lot of vets, John, and this really isn't about your medals or
> how you got them. Like you, I have a Silver Star and a Bronze Star. I
> only have two Purple Hearts, though. I turned down the others so that I
> could stay with the Marines in my rifle platoon. But I think you might
> agree with me, though I've never heard you say it, that the officers
> always got more medals than they earned and the youngsters we led never
> got as many medals as they deserved.
>
> This really isn't about how early you came home from that war, either,
> John. There have always been guys in every war who want to go home. There
> are also lots of guys, like those in my rifle platoon in Vietnam, who did
> a full 13 months in the field. And there are, thankfully, lots of young
> Americans today in Iraq and Afghanistan who volunteered to return to war
> because, as one of them told me in Ramadi a few weeks ago, "the job isn't
> finished."
>
> Nor is this about whether you were in Cambodia on Christmas Eve, 1968.
> Heck John, people get lost going on vacation. If you got lost, just say
> so. Your campaign has admitted that you now know that you really weren't
> in Cambodia that night and that Richard Nixon wasn't really president
> when you thought he was. Now would be a good time to explain to us how
> you could have all that bogus stuff "seared" into your memory --
> especially since you want to have your finger on our nation's nuclear
> trigger.
>
> But that's not really the problem, either. The trouble you're having,
> John, isn't about your medals or coming home early or getting lost -- or
> even Richard Nixon. The issue is what you did to us when you came home,
> John.
>
> When you got home, you co-founded Vietnam Veterans Against the War and
> wrote "The New Soldier," which denounced those of us who served -- and
> were still serving -- on the battlefields of a thankless war. Worst of
> all, John, you then accused me -- and all of us who served in Vietnam --
> of committing terrible crimes and atrocities.
>
> On April 22, 1971, under oath, you told the Senate Foreign Relations
> Committee that you had knowledge that American troops "had personally
> raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones
> to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up
> bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent
> of Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and
> generally ravaged the country side of South Vietnam." And you admitted on
> television that "yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as
> thousands of other soldiers have committed."
>
> And for good measure you stated, "(America is) more guilty than any other
> body, of violations of (the) Geneva Conventions ... the torture of
> prisoners, the killing of prisoners."
>
> Your "antiwar" statements and activities were painful for those of us
> carrying the scars of Vietnam and trying to move on with our lives. And
> for those who were still there, it was even more hurtful. But those who
> suffered the most from what you said and did were the hundreds of
> American prisoners of war being held by Hanoi. Here's what some of them
> endured because of you, John:
>
> Capt. James Warner had already spent four years in Vietnamese custody
> when he was handed a copy of your testimony by his captors. Warner says
> that for his captors, your statements "were proof I deserved to be
> punished." He wasn't released until March 14, 1973.
>
> Maj. Kenneth Cordier, an Air Force pilot who was in Vietnamese custody
> for 2,284 days, says his captors "repeated incessantly" your one-liner
> about being "the last man to die" for a lost cause. Cordier was released
> March 4, 1973.
>
> Navy Lt. Paul Galanti says your accusations "were as demoralizing as
> solitary (confinement) ... and a prime reason the war dragged on." He
> remained in North Vietnamese hands until February 12, 1973.
>
> John, did you think they would forget? When Tim Russert asked about your
> claim that you and others in Vietnam committed "atrocities," instead of
> standing by your sworn testimony, you confessed that your words "were a
> bit over the top." Does that mean you lied under oath? Or does it mean
> you are a war criminal? You can't have this one both ways, John. Either
> way, you're not fit to be a prison guard at Abu Ghraib, much less
> commander in chief.
>
> One last thing, John. In 1988, Jane Fonda said: "I would like to say
> something ... to men who were in Vietnam, who I hurt, or whose pain I
> caused to deepen because of things that I said or did. I was trying to
> help end the killing and the war, but there were times when I was
> thoughtless and careless about it and I'm ... very sorry that I hurt
> them. And I want to apologize to them and their families."
>
> Even Jane Fonda apologized. Will you, John?
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
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