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Mr. Gilmore,
Very well put!!! I for one commend you as being better with words than
me.
James Shanks
The Line Below is my Ham Radio Callsign
n1vbn@bit-net.com
The line below is my Ham Radio Packet Address
n1vbn@N1VBN @ WB1DSW.NH.USA.NOAM
-----Original Message-----
From: jim gilmore <jgilmore@oeonline.com>
To: Military Vehicles List <mil-veh@uller.skylee.com>
Date: Sunday, March 19, 2000 6:52 PM
Subject: [MV] Stupid Tests & HMMWV Registrations
>*This message was transferred with a trial version of CommuniGate(tm) Pro*
>
>
>
>>jonathon <jemery@execpc.com> wrote:
>> > .....According to Lee Holland (President of MVPA) whom I spoke to about
this last
>> > summer, one of these requiements that the hmmwv does not meet is that
there
>> > is no place on the rear bumper to mount a license plate.......
>
>Mark wrote,
>>...... But if they're going to use the lack
>>of a license plate bracket to deny me the use of my vehicle...
>
> I have read the postings on this issue with much interest since I
was one of the first civilians in the country to title, register, license,
insure and drive a military Hummer. Or should I say my 1984 AM General,
Utility body vehicle, # PRD351 (as my registration and AAA insurance slips
said).
>
> Most of us on the list have little experience with something we
Machine Gun people call "The Stupid Test". As I am a holder of a Federal
Firearms License with a NFA endorsement I must deal with officials and
bureaucrats on local, county, state and federal levels as do many of my
customers. I have seen many different versions of this test at all levels.
>
> What is a stupid test you say? Simple. It is a statement made to see
if you are; A, so stupid as to believe the statement thereby allowing the
person making the statement to intimidate you and prevent you from
continuing on in whatever it is you want to do. OR; B, that you are NOT
stupid enough to believe the statement forcing the person making it to deal
with you on a factual basis from that point on.
>
> Quick example of a stupid test. A customer of mine (who holds a federal
collectors license) took his machine gun transfer form (form 4) to his local
police chief to have him sign it. The chief refused telling him "It is
illegal for citizens to own machine guns". The customer then came back to
me crestfallen that he could not get the gun he had wanted. I explained the
"Stupid Test" to him, "armed" him with copies of the Local, State and
Federal laws and the Attorney General of the State of Michigan's
determination that it was legal for collectors to own such weapons and sent
him back. When the chief gave him the stupid test again, he presented him
with all the facts. The chief, seeing my customer had failed the test (he
was NOT stupid) immediately signed the form. (No disrespect to police here,
this IS a true story)
>
> What's this got to do with this Hummer discussion? Simple. A
statement like "you can't own/license a Hummer because it doesn't have a
place on the rear bumper for a license plate bracket" is a Stupid Test plain
and simple!
> If you're stupid.....you'll say "darn, and I really wanted one of
those Hummers. If it only had a bracket.
> If your not stupid.....(like John, Mark and most of us) you'll say
"no problem, I'll just make one. Please show me the Local, State and Federal
regulations on the license plate brackets" Now you've put the onus on them
to (A) Show you why a bracket cannot be fitted and (B) dig out the
regulations on the same. They will now realize that the next thing they
tell you had better not be more B.S. because you're not stupid and you want
proof (in writing).
>
> It has been stated that the Hummers from that auction were sold as
"off road" vehicles. If the buyers signed an agreement to that effect then
they may be bound by that agreement (I'm not a attorney). If you purchased
a vehicle from one of them and did not sign an agreement then you may not
have to abide by it. The agreement may itself have been a "Stupid Test" and
something that seems binding but is legally not.
>
> The letter from AM General certainly looks like a "Stupid Test". The
idea being that you read the letter and take it at face value, and never
license your vehicle. OR you contact an attorney, check local, State and
Federal laws and see if they in fact can prohibit you from making it street
legal and operate upon the roads and highways.
>
> Humm........upon the highways.........Maybe we need to give AM
General a "Stupid Test" of our own.
>
> Something along the lines of this;
>
> To: AM General, Office of Legal Counsel
>
> Dear Sirs,
>
> I am in receipt of a copy of your letter stating that Hummers (HUMVEE)
manufactured for the Armed Forces and subsequently sold on the civilian
market are for off road use only due to said vehicles being unfit and
lacking safety features required for use upon the public highways. This
revelation is most distressing. Said vehicles are operated daily upon the
public highways by members of the Armed Forces of the United States both
here and abroad. These military personnel are our sons and daughters and
their safety and well being concern all of us. It would seem unconscionable
that AM General Corporation would manufacture, much less allow a vehicle so
unsafe as to be limited to off road use to be operated upon the public
highways by the military.
> I would point out that said vehicles are operated on the very same
public highways and in the presence and conjunction with vehicles operated
by the public at large. If the allegations in your letter are correct this
may constitute a clear and present danger to the public at large and to the
members of the Armed Forces who operate these vehicles.
> I believe it would be unconscionable of me not make this grave danger
known. I believe that, If your letter is correct, action should be taken to
prevent the Armed Forces of the United States from operating said AM General
produced vehicles on any public roads and highways world wide.
> I also believe it would be unconscionable of me to alert my elected
representatives, both State and Federal, and the media, without first
allowing your office to clarify your position on the safety and roadability
of your vehicle design.
> Sincerely,
>
> (add your name)
>
> Now, does anyone think AM General wants publicity stating the Hummer
is unsafe? Who would want to buy a civilian one if the basic design is
unsafe?
>
> Perhaps the next "Stupid Test" from AMG might be a little
different........
>
>
> Jim Gilmore MVPA # 5843
>
>Member Ist Michigan AOD Chapter MVPA
> Great Lakes Chapter MVPA
> Ohio Motor Pool Chapter MVPA
> Red Ball Chapter MVPA
> Ontario Military Vehicle Association
> Midwest Military Vehicle Assocation
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This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Tue Apr 04 2000 - 21:57:19 PDT